June 19, 2025

Spice on the Side: A Conversation With Blue Cactus

June 19, 2025/ Caleb Doyle

With their third full-length album, North Carolina’s Blue Cactus has built on the rock-solid Classic country sounds they developed on their first two records—and they’re getting a little weird with it this time. Believer feels like what happens when you doze off on the screened-in front porch after putting a little something funny in your sweet tea. The familiar sounds comfort you, but then your mind drifts to something a bit more exploratory and cosmic.

Steph Stewart’s vocal range is truly impressive, and her songwriting style builds the perfect framework for it. Mario Arnez lays down some classically Sun Records style guitar work, but isn’t afraid to let Trey Anastasio influence the tone or experimentation.

Believer is comforting, gentle, and contemplative, and it brings surprise after surprise that welcome multiple relistens. It’s a fantastic summer album that blurs the lines between country music subgenres.

It was Steph and Mario’s first time in Kansas City, and I was lucky to welcome them to the Heartland. We sat down at Slap’s BBQ on the Kansas side, before their show at The Ship on the Missouri side. We talked about Believer, Hurricane Helene, Weird Al, cheesecake, and State Parks. Blue Cactus is finishing their tour up in the Northeast and New England through July.

SWIM: I mentioned earlier, Blue Cactus has a very classic sound. There is that Patsy Cline element, that kind of squeaky-clean Nashville Sound, especially on your early records. But the music has really evolved.

Steph, you’ve talked about the women of Lilith Fair being a big inspiration, and Mario, you've talked about your early experiences with Weird Al’s music being a big inspiration. What is the importance of having diverse influences and a variety of tastes outside of country/Americana music?

MARIO: I don't think you can separate anything, especially these days. Just having so much music available to us and growing up in the 90s into the 2000s where we were getting a lot of whatever MTV was feeding us, I grew up with a lot of the popular stuff. And then, yeah, Weird Al’s survey of Pop music, mixed in with a little polka, just kind of opened me up to all kinds of music.

SWIM: Those polkas really introduced me to a lot of songs that I hadn't heard before.

STEPH: And I think with Lilith Fair, I was really drawn to other women making music when I was coming up. So that was pretty influential, and there were just so many different styles of singing.

My family was really big into karaoke, so that's how I got into performing in front of people, doing that with them. We would go almost every Wednesday night to the Dragon Palace. It's this American Japanese restaurant in Hickory (North Carolina). We would just sing karaoke there, and it got me to enjoy the limelight a little bit. I would try out all kinds of songs. And my dad got a karaoke system at the house. First, it was like LaserDisc, and then he eventually upgraded to the same thing that they had at the karaoke bars. So I would basically practice at home, really just trying to imitate people. I think that really strengthened my voice a lot. I got a pretty big range from that. I mean, I was singing everything from like Sarah McLachlan, to the Cranberries, to Jewel, and of course, Patsy Cline and 90s country like Shania Twain.

I think it just got me trying stuff early on. I didn't have formal voice training, but I feel like that was it.

SWIM: You both mentioned the 90s. I've noticed that, specifically what you might refer to as alt-country, is having a big moment. Country music, Americana, and folk are all having a bit of a moment right now, kind of a Renaissance. My theory is that it goes back to the fertile period for country music in the 90s and 2000s, which I think was an inspiration to people our age.

Especially in your home of North Carolina! MJ Lenderman and Wednesday are from Asheville. Fust is from Durham. North Carolina is really a breeding ground for this genre and its subgenres.

What is the importance of community for fostering a scene like the one in North Carolina?

STEPH: I think our immediate community has just been such a huge support. It's hard putting out a record! Having something like Sleepy Cat Records, which is really just a group of friends who are also musicians, and they believe in your work and want to see it get out there, sometimes that’s what it takes. It's hard to know how much of a drive I'd have at this point if it weren't for them. We all play music with each other, too.

Our drummer is one of the founders of that label! He's literally the backbone of the band and a pillar in our community. That (the community) really does make this all feel worthwhile. Like I said, I don’t know if I’d still be doing this if it weren't for other musicians in general.

The night before last, we stayed at our friend Dylan Earl's house, and he’s stayed at our house multiple times. It’s so important to have this network of a road family who also know what it’s like and do this, and we just help each other out.

It's just really restorative to be in that company of people who get it and give you a place to relax. We didn't even want to go downtown and walk around. It's like, no, let's just sit on your front porch!

MARIO: There are a lot of other bands and folks running labels in The Triangle (North Carolina’s “Research Triangle,” comprised of Durham, Raleigh, and Chapel Hill, and everything inside the triangle that those cities form). There are great studios and a bunch of different festivals and live events going on. So there are a lot of folks that you end up interacting with over the years being in the scene. It feels like a nice, dynamic place to be!

STEPH: Recently, the previous governor enacted new funding to go specifically towards North Carolina music. So they have a whole Arts Committee that basically oversees it, and there's this new financial support, which is so critical. We've been fortunate to work with that organization, Come Hear NC, and they've helped fund projects the labels put together. This can give that extra amplification as an artist in that area, which is really great.

SWIM: It's crucial to what you do! There are conversations about why there's a dearth of artists and musicians in some places, and it's like, well, people can't pay their rent. So if you give people money to do those essential things, they can be making art instead of working doubles every weekend.

On the same token as your community, late last year, Hurricane Helene ravaged the Southeastern part of the country, largely in places like Western North Carolina. Blue Cactus contributed to a 136-track compilation album, Cardinals at the Window, which gave 100% of proceeds via Bandcamp to relief efforts in NC and greater Appalachia.

What was it like to have so many musicians contribute to this thing that was supporting your home? And what role do artists play in a disaster of that magnitude?

MARIO: People absolutely turn to music when they need something to pull them along. I mean, there’s absolutely no substitute for federal funding and disaster relief. But yeah, in the small ways that we can help, it was a no-brainer to contribute to that (Cardinals at the Window).

We also bought chainsaws and sent supplies all over North Carolina. There are some great mutual aid organizations around us that we were able to connect with quickly.

STEPH: Overall, the touring lifestyle is very much in the ethos of mutual aid.

Staying at each other’s houses and helping out however you can, that’s just sort of built into the way a lot of musicians live. So the immediate reaction when something that devastating happens is like, how can we help people? And, yeah, of course, federal aid.

Marshall, North Carolina, was almost wiped off the map. The river got completely rerouted. A lot of those people were musicians that were friends of ours. So they basically had to act as first responders. And we were just in touch with them, like, what do y'all need from where we were at?

SWIM: We just had a huge tornado come through the north part of St. Louis City. That was like three weeks ago, and they just got federal funding in some small way. People have been up there every day cleaning up people's homes, you know?

STEPH: I'm sorry that happened. It just feels like it's become more and more common.

SWIM: I know. Unfortunately, I think that's what they were telling us about climate change. And nobody in charge really took it seriously.

Anyhow, for a more, um, uplifting question: Do you have an album or a song that you go to when you want to roll the windows down and drive around?

STEPH: I really love Bill Withers’s “Lovely Day.” It's one of my forever favorite songs, and that song really does help me get my day off to a good start. I should probably be listening to it a little bit more lately, because I just have to wake up and go, and I think I need a little bit of a morning soundtrack some days.

MARIO: I've got polarizing opinions here. When I need to drive, we've got a long stretch and we need to go, go, go. If I need something that I know I'm not gonna be flipping tracks or anything, I just put on some live Phish.

SWIM: Oh hell yeah. I love to hear that!

STEPH: Yeah, he listens to that a lot.

SWIM: Love to hear that. I was just listening to The Gorge ’98 this week.

MARIO: Great year.

SWIM: Great choices, both.

For the new album, Believer, Steph, you took some original photos, and Mario, you used those photographs to make some graphic design art on the cover and inserts. In addition, this is your third full-length album, and you’ve been making music together for at least eight years. Does the music and the act of putting together an album feel more personal now?

MARIO: Absolutely. I feel like this is definitely the most elbow grease we've put into a release, on a personal level. It feels like with every release, we’ve figured out how to put more of ourselves into the music.

We also just try to spend a little bit less money along the way! But yeah, over the Pandemic, we kind of picked up other skills.

STEPH: Yeah, I’m a perpetual hobbyist. I feel like I'm constantly finding new art forms that I want to dabble in and learn how to do. So it just seemed like, well, these photos look great.

We both felt those photos really made sense with the theme of the record. The whole process of taking those pictures was wild because I was kind of disappointed. The field had started to die. All these sunflowers were just dying. And I had black and white film, and I thought I would get something different initially.

It was like, well, I'm here. I might as well just take some pictures and see what happens. As I was walking around the park, there were so many birds there. A lot of goldfinches and other pollinators. It felt like those sunflowers were more full of life at that point than they were when they were in full bloom. They were about to drop their seeds and create food for all these birds.

It's funny how you look at something on the surface and don't initially see that kind of beauty in it.

SWIM: Yeah. It's like reframing what we think about the cycles of nature.

I think it's in The Great Gatsby where he talks about how “life starts all over again when it gets crisp in the Fall.” We think of the fall as everything starting to die, but it’s really this big clearing-out. Readying for what's to come next.

Have you picked up a live performance hack or tip?

STEPH: This isn't anything that revolutionary, but I almost always have to sing along in the van on the way there, so I warm up my voice. I don't do a lot of formal warmups, but I love singing before we’re actually on stage, and singing other songs that aren't ours.

Reba McEntire is a really good warmup because she's got this incredible range. If I can sing one of her songs, then I know I'll be ready.

MARIO: Shake off the cobwebs. If you've been driving for a couple hours and you've just been sort of a hermit for over half the day, you really gotta clear out the cobwebs. Either start talking out loud all of a sudden, or do some stretching. I feel like that's number one, just to make sure that we're not feeling like we're still rolling out of bed all day.

STEPH: Staying in State Parks on this tour has been really helpful. Most of the time, we'll have time to go on a nice walk. It helps me feel really awake and ready, for sure.

SWIM: What's the most recent physical media you've bought?

STEPH: Hmm.

MARIO: Clothes?

STEPH: No, those don't count.

It's been a little while now, but I did buy a Linda Ronstadt record at the Fuzzy Needle (in Wilmington, NC).

SWIM: If this album was a dish or a meal, what would it be?

STEPH: Hmm. Interesting. Well, maybe this is just because I like it, but I definitely think the dessert would be cheesecake. Let's just start there.

SWIM: That's the way to do it. Start with dessert.

STEPH: Mm-hmm. Cheesecake and probably not plain cheesecake. I think it would have some kind of like raspberry sauce.

[to Mario] What kind of a main course are we talking about? Or an appetizer, for that matter?

He is the cook in our family.

MARIO: This is just funny. This comes back to the question of influences versus what the music actually sounds like.

It doesn't feel like it would just be some everyday meal that I'm whipping up. Yeah. We're talking something outside the norm!

Okay…we open with a Greek salad…

STEPH: I think that sounds great. I don't know why I'm thinking fried chicken. [To Mario] Are you thinking fried chicken?

MARIO: Sure!

STEPH: Okay, and then you're gonna need a couple of sides with that.

MARIO: This is not turning into a James Beard meal...

STEPH: I feel like we should really put more thought into this!

SWIM: It’s eclectic, though!

STEPH: Maybe hot chicken! But not too hot.

MARIO: Like a two on the spice? And you can add your own?

STEPH: Yeah, you can add your own spice. It'll be spice on the side.

I feel like there are a lot of shifts on the record. So, you do have that country kind of twangy stuff right at the top. That feels like hot chicken. But then you're getting into the synths and swirly stuff, and maybe that's like some kind of mashed potatoes, but they're not your classic ones.

There's gonna be something a little special left of the center. Yeah. [To Mario] What would that be?

MARIO: I mean, I don't mess around with truffles…

STEPH: No, I don't like those either.

MARIO: I think a James Beard type would do that, but I wouldn't!

SWIM:. Maybe just not a smooth mashed potato. Maybe there's some chunks.

STEPH: You like a chunk?

SWIM: Oh, I love a chunk.

STEPH: You can tell they're real potatoes!

SWIM: Mm-hmm.

I also love the fact that this answer took thought and collaboration. I think that speaks volumes of the record. It's one of those records that, at the end, you kind of do finally exhale.

It is comforting, it's dreamy, it kind of has your head in the clouds a bit, but then there are some experimental aspects to it. And that makes it so fun!

Caleb Doyle (St. Louis, MO) is a music writer and dive bar enthusiast. He would love to talk to you about pro wrestling, your favorite cheeseburger, and your top 10 American rock bands. You can find Caleb on most social media @ClassicDoyle, or subscribe to his music Substack, Nightswimming, HERE.

June 06, 2025

Re-Entering The Void: Interviewing With Sails Ahead On Their Debut Album’s First Anniversary

June 06, 2025/ Ciara Rhiannon

I’ve been fortunate enough to know New Jersey post-hardcore band With Sails Ahead over the past several years, ever since I found them in 2021 through their single “In Fear and Loathing.” It’s difficult to put into words the effect this band has had on me, but the lyrics “No act of god can save me,” which I have tattooed on my right wrist, do a lot of heavy lifting there. Over the past four years, With Sails Ahead has let me in on their creative process, welcomed me as both a friend and a fan, and even invited me to tour with them last December as part of the Rock Star Energy Tour. I've watched their catalog grow across multiple EPs and singles, culminating in their debut LP, Infinite Void, released in April 2024. The past year has been a whirlwind for the band, between touring and playing local shows, marketing their first record, and most recently adding their new drummer, Deirdre O’Connor, to the group.

To celebrate their first LP turning one year old in April, I had the pleasure of speaking with singer Sierra Binondo, bassist Jaime Martinez, and guitarist Joe Warner-Reyes about Infinite Void’s first anniversary and the process behind bringing their debut album into the world.

This interview has been edited for clarity and length.

SWIM: Thanks for coming, guys. It was really fun talking with pulses. and figuring out how I want to do all this. I'm trying to do really casual conversations with this series, and it just so happens that these first two also coincide with anniversaries.

Before we jump in, what is everybody listening to right now?

JOE: I got nothing good. I mean it's the same old.

SWIM: Closure? [Laughs]

JOE: Closure In Moscow. [Laughs]

SIERRA: I love them. I could stand to listen to them more. I loved the Audiotree, it blew my mind.

JAIME: That's one of the best Audiotrees for sure.

I've been listening to a lot of the Snooze record. I really enjoy it, just really visceral math rock. The guitar tones are really punchy in a very cool way. I'm on my K-pop fix again. That’s all I’m listening to in the car.

SWIM: Sierra’s a bad influence.

[All laugh]

SIERRA: I looked at my [Spotify] Wrapped last year, and it was like 75% K-pop. I'm like, “Oh my god, I need to listen to more music!” And what's happening is that it ends up being half K-pop still, because of my gym playlist, but then the other half, I've been really branching out into a lot of different stuff. I've been going back to a lot of 90s pop lately. Janet Jackson and Christina Aguilera. Also the new Snooze record. I recently went through and listened to Kero Kero Bonito ‘cause I was like, “Wow, I could really stand to know more of their discography.” Louie Zong is an artist I love who does music across whatever genres he wants, basically. He's very prolific.

SWIM: Yeah, something I was talking to Kevin and pulses. about was how most people aren't listening to five albums a day and constantly churning through new music. Most people are breaking down one or maybe two new releases a week, and then just going back to old favorites or only listening to music a couple of times a week, but not regularly. It's something I give myself a hard time about, but realistically, I do a lot of my music listening in the shower. Being able to have that moment where I'm not doing anything else and have a good half hour to listen to something. It's hard to do a lot of dedicated listening for sure.

SIERRA: Absolutely. I don't listen to podcasts anymore because I don't commute to work. When I'm working at a desk, I struggle to listen intently to anything. It’s gotta be like lo-fi or instrumental video game music. I won't be able to fully enjoy what's happening. I remember when the new Coheed album came out, I really enjoyed it, but most of my listening was at my work desk, and I could not describe that album to you with a gun to my head.

SWIM: One of my colleagues at Swim was talking about how good the new Japanese Breakfast album was and I could assume that it would fit the vibe of a cafe, so I threw it on today while I was working and it was the same thing where I'm registering some cool things, but obviously not doing very conscious listening. I kind of cheat that way; if something is a little bit more palatable or slower or accessible, I'll throw it on at work when I have an opening shift or I'm the only one working and can control the music.

SWIM: Infinite Void is celebrating its one-year anniversary this month. How are y’all feeling about that?

JAIME: I honestly can't believe it's been a year already. And Joe has Twizzlers to celebrate the one-year anniversary. Infinite Twizzlers. [Laughs]

JOE: I love chewing on plastic.

SIERRA: When you think about it, plastic is in everything we consume.

SWIM: Twizzlers are macroplastics.

[All laugh]

SIERRA: Ahh, it’s so weird. Weird is the principal feeling for me. I'm glad we released it when we did, ‘cause it felt like we had most of the year to push this album. I don't know what it is, but when the calendar year flips and it's a new year, I do compartmentalize and pack away anything I experienced in 2024 and leave it there. It also feels like it wasn't enough time, you know what I mean? Album cycles have changed so much. That was also a chapter of our lives. So, it's weird to say that's a year away now. Like, “Oh my god, when did we jump out of that?” I never really wanted to, but time just happens.

SWIM: Yeah, absolutely. When I asked pulses. about Speak It Into Existence turning five, David was so serious, like “Fastest five years of my life.” It's just a fucking vacuum. Post-COVID, even one year just compresses way down. I don't feel like Infinite Void came out a year ago. That’s insane.

JAIME: In a lot of ways, the album cycle still seems fresh to me, even though it has been a year.

SWIM: Album cycles never end.

SIERRA: They just stack.

JOE: I'm ready to start promoting Infinite Void. That’s what it feels like.

[All laugh]

SWIM: Give everybody a year to kind of feel it out by themselves, and now I really wanna push this record.

SIERRA: I am so stoked to announce we're now promoting our record.

JOE: I feel like I still have motivation to do stuff, you know? The tabs are coming out soon. Having just done that makes it kind of fresh. I want to record videos for all of the songs. It still feels fresh, even though it's a year old.

JAIME: And also for us to start playing some of our other songs that we have yet to play live from the record. There's plenty of stuff that we still have yet to debut live. That'll be a lot of fun to switch things up and get people to hear some of the tunes that maybe people haven't heard as much as “Darting Eyes” or “Swear Words.”

SWIM: Absolutely. I forgot, have you guys debuted “Peach Tea (Obituary)” yet, or are you doing it on this next tour?

JAIME: We did play it in Brooklyn in November, I believe. So that was the first time we played it, but we haven't played it since.

SWIM: Cool. You can save it for a tour that I can attend, and I'll be so happy. You got the t-shirt and that's fine.

Are there songs that, a year later, have flipped for you or sound new to you?

JOE: Playing “Catastrophe” live is super cool, because there are certain things on the recording that, because of how it was mixed, it's not like how it sounds live. It's cool to hear it live and have it be different from how it sounds on the recording.

SWIM: One of the great things about listening to music live is the way that the band or the artist is interpreting it, and it'll never be the exact same, hopefully, as it is on the recorded version.

SIERRA: I guess I shouldn't be surprised that everyone loves hearing “what if i fall,” everyone loves that one. And because of how much it’s been demanded, I don't love it less, but I'm like, “What about all the other stuff on the album? Do you guys not like this stuff? You just want this one?” [Laughs]

SWIM: Right. You have the singles that obviously people are more aware of, and then you have the immediately popular ones. So that leaves a small chunk of songs that you're like, ‘Well, what about these guys?’ [Laughs]

SIERRA: Yeah, exactly. I was really hoping people would take to “Oblivion,” ‘cause that's a direction I would like to explore some more. I mean the world’s our oyster, we're going to do a lot of stuff, but I thought people would be into that one because it's more thrashy and darker.

SWIM: Well, that's why you attached it to “Y.E.R. (Your Eternal Ring),” right? You were like, “What if it plays into ‘Oblivion?’ Oops.” [Laughs]

I think it's a banger. I mean, obviously, I think the whole record is a banger, but I think “Oblivion” is definitely an underrated one for sure.

SIERRA: Thank you. What I was really delighted by was that we sequenced the album in a way where the more mellowed-out songs were in the middle, and there was an intermission. I don't have to explain it to you, but this weird corner of music we're in has certain preferences, and they don't like it when you stray too far outside the box. I love that the record is so varied. I love that it has different moods. So, we were like, “All right, let's smack it in the middle and see what happens,” and a lot of people love those songs, like “Peach Tea” and “Picture Perfect Pixels.” I was waiting to see how people reacted, but I was very pleased with that, and it surprised me in a way. I was confident, but also like, “I don't understand the common listener anymore – and then everyone also jives. Awesome.”

SWM: The kids are alright.

SWIM: Obviously, it was your first record, a lot went into it. Sierra, you’ve mentioned in the past that it was a lot of stress, and it consumed your whole life until it was released. What did you learn from Infinite Void that you can apply to new releases and LP two?

JAIME: For this next batch of recordings, whether it be LP two or something else, it's just going to be a more refined approach to what we did for Infinite Void. We've recorded with each other for quite a long time, so we know how we work together. I'd like to think that the process will just continue to be more streamlined. We know what to prepare for a little better.

JOE: Going into the new batch of songs, I think, regardless of how Infinite Void turned out, we just wanna do what we want and play what we love. Not let song plays or numbers affect what we want to do. We're just going to do what we love and do what we feel like.

SIERRA: To Jaime’s point, a lot of the songs that went on Infinite Void were not jammed in real life before we recorded them. It was straight from Guitar Pro to the session, and we learned a huge lesson. Maybe there's a way to do that where you don't run into what we ran into. We discovered that things took up the same space in the stereo field, or there were phase issues with certain riffs, things of that nature. So, we are trying to ensure that we incorporate everything in real life before tracking it, just to make sure if there’s anything we want to take out. Things that we could improve while we have the chance, before committing to them on recording.

To Joe’s point, a lot of these songs are the best shit we've ever written and I did feel insane when we dropped this record and everyone just kind of turned over a new page the following week. This is what people are talking about when they say that no one’s attention span is there anymore. We had some plans to promote in the weeks following, but we were on tour!

JAIME: Literally the week after.

SIERRA: That was the first time we've ever toured a record. I just felt insane, because we had very high hopes for this record. I don't like to send demos or anything to anybody anymore, because I just don't want to hear anything in the interim where it's like, ‘Oh, the recording is done, but you can't change anything now that this person has had this lukewarm response.’ The thing was, a lot of people we know didn’t have lukewarm responses, so we were like, “Maybe we have something here. People keep telling us.” I did not set realistic expectations, but I also burned myself out trying to promote this record.

Something I learned that I will take with me is that no matter who you are, you have everybody's attention for a week. If you are strategic enough, you can expand that to three weeks. I've watched amazing records get brushed over in the last five years, and the reality is that people are just going to move on. It’s a law of nature at this point. I wish that I didn't drive myself so insane. I would probably be more strategic in that. Hit it really fucking hard and plan for three weeks of bullshit spamming people with and then just disappear. It doesn't matter, and in a way, saying that is kind of freeing.

SWIM: There's a beauty in relinquishing that pressure and responsibility. That’s the thing with the digital age and all of us having all recorded music at our fingertips all the time. That, along with the idea that something is considered outdated even if it's only a year old. If someone found Infinite Void now there would be some motherfucker out there saying, “Oh, it's from last year? Why are you listening to that?” The kinds of people who are only listening to what’s new, which is insane to me. Especially because, like you were saying, Sierra, I've been going back to a lot of 90s and early 00s stuff, and it's still there. It's still good. They're still going to make money off of it if I actually buy it. You guys can still reach people, and people will still be finding the record.

There's so much pressure to hang on to that initial attention span and get those jingly keys as long as possible for people, but now more than ever, there is freedom in letting people move on, and trusting that they'll come back to it. I do it all the time. There's something to be said about celebrating something when it's being released, being excited about it, being proud of it, getting that well-deserved attention for however long you can, but it's still out. People can still listen to it. You guys are still jamming those songs, obviously. You'll still attract new people all the time who find it.

SIERRA: Yeah, that’s true

SWIM: Is there anything that you guys didn't get around to on Infinite Void, or are you starting from scratch material-wise on the next release?

JOE: More sonic textures. More ambiance. Different sounds, production styles. Incorporating elements from different genres. Production specifically – including synths, percussion, different elements like that. I want to add vibraphone to a song. Stuff that would obviously have to be recreated with a plugin, but still.

SWIM: Speaking of percussion, you guys just got a new drummer, which is super exciting. How's it been bringing Dee into the fold?

SIERRA: She has been ready since frame one. Really, we just tell her what to learn.

JAIME: I've been just amazed since day one that we jammed with her. She knew all the tunes, and maybe there were very tiny notes, maybe a few things, but I was all for it. I was ready to just give her the drummer job right then and there.

SIERRA: We've known her for years. Joe's known her the longest out of all of us. I mean, Ciara you know her from American Stereo, right? She was in a metal band before that, too. It's one of those things where we had another drummer for so long that we didn't know who would've possibly been interested. She was like, “Yeah, I always thought it would've been cool to play with you guys, I had to jump at the opportunity,” and she really is the best person for the job. She has experience playing multiple different genres of music. Math rock, metal, and punk. All these areas that our music sort of touches. She's very creative. I love the way she plays the “Catastrophe” outro live. I'm very excited for people to see that at shows, because she puts her own spin on it.

JAIME: People are in for a treat when we play catastrophe live with Dee. It's going to be sick.

SIERRA: She learned everything so fast. It's crazy.

SWIM: That's awesome. I think a lot of the time, when people think about the identity of a band, maybe they think about the front person. That is, if the front person leaves or changes, it's either the end of the band or a huge change. But when a bassist or drummer changes, people don't register it the same. I think with you guys and Dee, it's very exciting to see how she's going to interpret the material she didn't write and put her own spin on it. This is a new era for you guys. You are such an instrumental band and every piece of With Sails Ahead, especially on Infinite Void, fucking hits, so I'm excited to hear what Dee does with it and how she puts her own identity on it, too.

JAIME: In a way, that'll help breathe some new life into the Infinite Void tunes as well.

SWIM: Absolutely. Well, thank you guys for hanging out and chatting about Infinite Void! Do you have any last thoughts on the album turning one? About the album in general? Anything you guys want to plug?

JAIME: Well, for me, all I can say is that ever since I started to pick up the bass and wanted to be in a band, the first thing I ever wanted to do was be on a full-length record. So, Infinite Void was the dream right there. This record will always have that space in my heart. I'll never forget this record.

JOE: Infinite Void was the first album I produced in full. It was a really cool experience, and I learned a lot. I'm excited for the future and being able to apply what I learned from Infinite Void to the next step.

SIERRA: I'm not even exaggerating when I say that releasing Infinite Void to me was bigger than my high school and college graduations. I’ve always dreamt of releasing a full-length album, and when you dream of that as a kid, you can't really predict what that's going to look like. I had the best possible first album experience of my life because of my bandmates. We felt so embarrassed for so long, ‘cause it was taking forever, but even though Infinite Void was a small moment for a lot of people, it was a massive chapter of my life, because it wasn't just everything that happened to each of us while we were making the record and all the things that the record is written about. We took our time with it. We actually got to enjoy the album writing process.

This is the case with a lot of things in life; you can't enjoy the slow burn. Everything is go, go, go. Fast turnaround. How quickly can you make a new song and stay relevant? Of course, you don't have to play the game. I have to remind myself of this often. I fucking fell off of making TikTok videos. I've fallen off on a lot of things, 'cause I learned that the world's still going to turn and I need to just breathe. Infinite Void is never going to leave me, ‘cause I learned so much. So much of it stays with me, but part of me is ready to move on to the next thing. I hope people still find it all the time and I want to give it its flowers as much as I can while we're not promoting some other bullshit.

[All laugh]

SWIM: Totally. Well, thank you all again so much for doing this! Love y’all so much and I’m excited to see what’s next for the band!

Ciara Rhiannon (she/her) is a pathological music lover writing out of a nebulous location somewhere in the Pacific Northwest within close proximity of her two cats. She consistently appears on most socials as @rhiannon_comma, and you can read more of her musical musings over at rhiannoncomma.substack.com.

April 23, 2025

Half A Decade of Speaking It Into Existence: An Interview with pulses.

April 23, 2025/ Ciara Rhiannon

On It Wasn’t Supposed To Be Like This, the Virginia-based post-hardcore act pulses. tackle the idea that we must make the most of difficult circumstances, that those hardships make us who we are and ultimately can lead to great things. I’ve never shied away from speaking about how pivotal pulses. were to my introduction to DIY, leading me to a music community that I’ve been able to foster through them. Over the past five years, I’ve been lucky enough to grow close to this band and celebrate their impact along with other fans, but around this time back in 2020, as an unforeseen pandemic was altering our lives forever, all I knew was a single called “Louisiana Purchase” and the album it was released on.

To celebrate five years of Speak It Into Existence, I sat down with pulses. frontmen Matt Burridge and Caleb Taylor, drummer Kevin Taylor, and bassist David Crane to discuss the album's creation and what makes it so special to not only the band but also those who found them through it.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

SWIM: How are you guys doing?

MATT: Solid. We practiced. David tracked some stuff. It's been cool.

CALEB: It's been a day.

KEVIN: [Laughs]

SWIM: Yeah, I worked earlier today, so I’m pretty fried.

Thank you for being here! I had this kind of epiphany earlier this week where I wanted to start doing these interviews, and I was like, “Well, pulses. is kind of where I started getting into my DIY interests and Speak It Into Existence (specifically), so it makes sense to go back and revisit the album.”

Before we dove into the album discussion, I was curious what everyone had been listening to first.

KEVIN: It's funny. I feel like I'm not listening to anything. It's the weirdest time where I'll listen to stuff in really quick bursts, and then I won't listen to stuff for like three days. It's odd.

SWIM: Yeah, I always have a weird complex like, “I’m not listening to enough music right now and definitely not enough new music,” so it’s nice to hear that other people are the exact same way. Nobody’s listening to new music constantly; it’s just whenever it happens.

KEVIN: Yeah, Sleigh Bells had a record that came out that was good. Scowl’s record is pretty good. The new PinkPantheress song is really good.

SWIM: [Heaven knows] was so fucking good, I’m excited for more from her!

KEVIN: Listening to the [Callous] Daoboys singles, they're all pretty good. The new Skrillex album was pretty good.

MATT: That new Deafheaven is really good. I feel like every year and a half, when I'm having writer's block, I watch all the “making of John Bellion" videos that he does, ‘cause he used to film the entire process of making a song and then edit it down to like ten minutes or whatever, and those get me feeling creative. His music is either terrible to me or really good.

I discovered Model/Actriz today. I'm really late on that, but they're really good. It's like dance-punk, post-punk. The new singles sound like live band versions of deadmau5 songs. It's crazy.

CALEB: Yeah, I've been lacking on newer stuff. I get overwhelmed pretty quickly with things, and lately, my time listening to music has been while I'm working or doing something else. So sometimes I'd rather give my focus on new music, like give actual focus on it and check it out. Especially if I'm working, I don't want to listen to new music to analyze it. I want to listen to something that makes me feel good, because I feel terrible while working. [Laughs]

Recently, I've been revisiting and re-listening to things I may have missed or previously listened to to gain new context. I listen to the first Foals record a lot.

One I revisited that I haven't listened to in a while was Bad Rabbit's second album.

SWIM: They’re very good! They’re super underrated.

CALEB: Absolutely. I love their first album a lot, and that stays in rotation. American Love and their EP, too.

MATT: Relient K is one that I just saw pop up! One of my hottest pop-punk/emo takes is that Mmhmm is one of the best pop-punk records of all-time.

SWIM: “Be My Escape” has one of the best pre-choruses in punk rock music.

CALEB: Yeah. The other day, while I was working, I listened to four of their albums. I went in reverse order. I started with Forget and Not Slow Down. That one's a sleeper. I actually like that album a lot.

MATT: I was going to say, you’re a Relient K oldhead. [Laughs]

David: I'm going back through The Acacia Strain discography. Slow Decay is honestly one of their best albums, and it's a pretty recent release. Some of their back catalog is really good, too.

MATT: It's like beatdown, fucking super heavy.

David: Humanity's Last Breath is also really good. They just put out a new song.

MATT: You’re the metal representation in our listening. [Laughs]

SWIM: Yeah, gotta keep things balanced.

SWIM: So, somehow, Speak It Into Existence is turning five this week.

David: That five years was fast as hell.

[All laugh]

SWIM: Time is a really fucked up vaccuum, especially since Covid. I think everybody who listened to that album when it came out is having a lot of feelings about it, but how are you guys feeling about that album turning five?

MATT: It’s weird. I feel like I don't listen to it, but I need to. I'll probably listen to it on the day or around the day, because I usually do that with each of our releases as they gain a year. I like parts of it more than others. I remember when we put out Speak Less, I was like, “I don't have a favorite of the two,” and then now I'm like, “Oh, I like Speak Less way more.” But I still like them both. Then there are a lot of people like you, that we've met on Twitter, who found us through [Speak It Into Existence] and have become really close with us off of that. So I hold it in a special place ‘cause it did things for us, but I don't listen to it much anymore, and we don't play a lot of it ‘cause it was super technical for all of us.

SWIM: Yeah, a lot of it is very shreddy. [Laughs]

MATT: Yeah, and trying to multitask doing that is hard, so we play the hits and that’s it.

CALEB: It's funny, I don't remember a lot of it. I feel like I have pushed out so much of that time, because we were working on it, primarily, my senior year of college, and that was not a good year. [Laughs]

I still remember when we put it out; I had a lab assignment due the same day, and I was working on it up until like midnight. I was just like, “All right, fuck this. I'm just gonna take whatever grade, I don't feel like working on this anymore. Let me celebrate the album release.” I still passed that class, and that was the last thing I needed to graduate, so yay for me, but definitely a weird time. Obviously, I'm always gonna be incredibly proud of it. I like a lot of the songs for it. Like Matt was saying, I like where it got us. I feel like that was the thing that established us in a lot of ways. I feel like bouquet. established us in our local scene, and then it got out somewhat, but Speak It Into Existence is where things started to expand past the local scene, and we were really starting to do some things. Still proud of it.

MATT: Even with the pandemic and everything, I think that might have helped it, honestly, ‘cause it was like within a month and a half of it starting.

CALEB: Yeah, nobody had shit to do.

MATT: Yeah, and nobody was dropping other than like a couple bands, but a lot of people were postponing their stuff, and we were like, “We've waited too long,” because that record took so long to make.

CALEB: “It's not like we have any marketing backing behind it or anything, so we can release whenever we want to.” [Laughs]

SWIM: Yeah, I remember around that time, before listening to “Louisiana Purchase” and this album, so much of my listening was just commercial music/non-DIY. It took my oldest brother and my friend Jack being like, “Yo, check out this single,” and that really was the start of it. I remember thinking, “Oh, these guys did this all by themselves. How do you do that? What is this process?” I recall that being the thing that stuck out for me. Hearing a song like “Louisiana Purchase” and just how professional it sounded to me – how polished – and my mind breaking a little. The fact that people can do that without being on a major label.

MATT: That's cool, because I feel like you and Will [Full Blown Meltdown] are like the two people that I know that are the most on top of DIY music now. So it's cool that we were kind of the start of it.

SWIM: Was he one of those early adopters as well?

MATT: I knew [Will] before he was doing FBM, because Will was Sam's brother's friend from high school. So, I think we posted that we were in Frederick or something, and then he messaged them and said, “Yo, I'm literally in this hair salon with my wife and she's getting her hair cut, come by.” I met him and we literally just sat there and talked. We were writing Speak Less at the time, and I was just like, “Oh yeah, we're putting out some stuff soon that sounds like Orchid and Satia. Then we kind of bonded over that. Now, I always joke with Sam every time I interact with him, I'm just like, “It's so funny to me that I talk to him more than you do now, and you’ve known him since you were a child.” [Laughs]

SWIM: Will is definitely the DIY hype man. He’s the kind of guy you want talking about your stuff. [Laughs]

MATT: Yeah, he's all over it. But that's cool, ‘cause we recorded it right here. Literally, I was sitting in this exact spot with my laptop.

CALEB: This was a guest bedroom at the time, too. So, there was a bed here.

MATT: We would finish at like three or four in the morning, [Caleb] would go upstairs ‘cause he still lived here at the time, and I would sleep on that bed that was in here. [Laughs]

SWIM: What’s it like having that connective tissue still to all of your recordings? Being in such a different place as a band, five years removed from that album, and doing it in the same space?

MATT: I don't think about it much, because it looks different in here now, you know what I mean? It's Kevin and Caleb’s house. I don't know if they think about it more that way, but it's a different room to me now.

KEVIN: It's very odd. I don't really think about it much. Not that I live here right now, but we've been here for like, what, 20 years, Caleb?

CALEB: I think we moved here in 2002, yeah.

SWIM: It’s been your folks’ home for that long.

KEVIN: Exactly. I guess it's just another piece of me growing up here. It doesn't register to me as a difference for the band. It's just like, “I used to have a twin-size bed and now I have a queen-size bed,” you know? You don't think about those changes, so I feel like it kind of stays the same.

SWIM: This is The pulses. Studio and it keeps evolving.

KEVIN: We shot “Untitled” in here, from the bouquet. era. We shot parts of “Bold New Taste” in here. We'd done those live stream recordings, but for me, they're all like somehow in a different room each time, but also in the same space. Different pieces of the same puzzle. It's weird.

CALEB: I think it grows with us. Funny enough, I was tracking drums for new Followship music, so that was the first time I was recording them here, and it was so funny, ‘cause they were somewhat geeking out. Like, “Oh shit, this is where y'all recorded the ‘I Drink Juice’ video! This is right here! Oh, this is where y'all did this!” And I'm like, “Yeah.” [Laughs]

Again, I don't really think about it in that way, ‘cause this is just the basement I grew up in. I was telling [Followship] even, “This is my whole life, my whole childhood, everything was here in this basement,” you know? They walked in and were just like, “Oh, you got the Rock Band drums graveyard.” We had all the New Year's parties with kids on the block here. It's just grown with us, and now it's the studio.

MATT: It's every room down here, too. You even go into the bathroom and you're like, “Oh my God! This is the bathroom from ‘The Message Is Clear’ video!” [Laughs]

SWIM: It’s becoming a pulses. museum.

CALEB: Honestly.

SWIM: I always mix up the timeline, because when I think of pulses., it’s obviously the current lineup with Matt in it, but what was the timeline with Matt joining and Speak It Into Existence coming out?

MATT: I joined in 2018, so [pulses.] put out “The Appetizer” and “Jecht Shot” like three months after I joined. They had me go ahead and record a second guitar on “Jecht Shot.” Not for “The Appetizer,” but I'm on “Jecht Shot.” That's my first thing, but it's just guitar. Then we started working on the album and didn't put anything out, just played a lot of shows. I didn't do vocals on that record. The lineup had changed before the album came out. So I think that's why a lot of people get confused with it, ‘cause we put it out and it was like, “Okay, but this isn't me, but I'm gonna be doing it from now on.” Since then, it's just been the four of us doing everything.

CALEB: I remember we had a number of songs already written for the album when Matt joined.

MATT: It was “Sometimes Y,” “Exist Warp Breaks,” “Mount Midoriyama.” “Olivia Wild” you had started. “Don't Say Anything, Just RT,” I think you had started.

“Graduation Day” [too].

KEVIN: That one's old.

MATT: Yeah. I just added parts to all of those. Then we wrote “Plastiglomerate” and “Louisiana Purchase” first. Which is wild, ‘cause they ended up being the singles. The title track was gonna be for Speak Less, and then we were like, “This will be a good opener. We'll make it longer and fill it out.” Then we wrote “Good Vibes Only (Zuckerberg Watchin’)” because we needed a pop song. It was almost the whole thing they had the instrumentals at least started for, then we wrote a couple core ones together.

SWIM: You touched on it a little bit, but how do you think lockdown and Covid affected the album, how it was released, and people’s relationship to it?

MATT: I think people attached to it because they were just not doing anything, so that helped. I think that helped it spread a little bit, because, realistically, if it wasn't Covid, we would've played a bunch of local shows and it would've probably not had as strong of an initial connection with people.

KEVIN: Didn't [Dance Gavin Dance] have an album that came out later?

CALEB: Yeah. That was the whole thing. [Laughs]

MATT: Later that month, I think.

KEVIN: Yeah, ‘cause we were trying to beat it. We had to drop it before…

CALEB: Afterburner.

SWIM: Oh, god.

KEVIN: Yeah, because if we dropped it after, no one was gonna care. So we rushed it to get the album out before them, and I honestly think that helped a lot.

SWIM: Do you regret not having a song in Spanish on Speak It Into Existence?

[All Laugh]

KEVIN: Honestly, I'm glad we don't for a number of reasons.

CALEB: If we did, we would actually have a native speaker on it.

MATT: If we did it now, we would get a feature that speaks Spanish. Andres or somebody who speaks Spanish. [Laughs]

SWIM: Yeah, you have no shortage of connections who could do that.

MATT: Not trying to Google translate my way through a verse.

KEVIN: As we've always said, there's just such a tumultuous relationship with that fucking band and I do think the fact that we dropped it before [Afterburner] was helpful. I feel like people listened to [Speak It Into Existence] and had their moments with it. Then [Afterburner] came out and the fact that it was weaker for a lot of people, they were like, “Oh, well if you don't like that shit, listen to Speak It Into Existence!” Then people suggested us more, and it got around that way.

MATT: People still liked that genre, so there was a fan base for it. Whether we were part of it or not.

KEVIN: Yeah, there wasn't any animosity.

MATT: Yeah, it wasn't as big of a deal then, but I still remember when we started getting reviews, one of the big ones was like, “Oh, ‘Exist Warp Brakes’ is like ‘Don't Tell Dave’ ‘cause it's like a funk thing!” And we were just like… stupid! [Laughs]

KEVIN: Yeah. “Dumb, but we’re just gonna let it rock,” because at the time, it wasn’t as annoying yet.

CALEB: I still remember back then, we were already trying to move off from it and were feeling that internally as the record was coming out. Especially because of how much time passed between us finishing it and when it came out, it was like, “I'm a different person now.” I think that album had the most time between us recording it and it actually coming out. That was the first album that we tracked ourselves. We started tracking it at [Matt’s] place.

MATT: Yeah, at my old apartment in West Virginia.

CALEB: I think we started with tracking guitars for “Louisiana Purchase” and “Exist Warp Brakes.” It was during that snowstorm, so it was like January 2019. And then we didn't finish tracking it all the way through until August?

MATT: We were almost done, but we were like, “We have to put out something,” so we dropped “Louisiana Purchase” in December. We were done, but I know we were waiting on two features that took a while. [Laughs]

We finished around October, then, because it was before the tour.

CALEB: Well, the tour was in September.

MATT: Oh, I guess it was August. It’s been over five years now, I can't fucking remember.

KEVIN: I wasn’t going to comment on any time thing, because I don't fucking remember. [Laughs]

MATT: I thought I remembered touching up things, but maybe I'm just thinking ‘cause we were writing Speak Less at the same time, and we were still doing that.

CALEB: I was still editing things, and I'm pretty sure we did one of those things where we got the master back for the record and then we put it out like two weeks later, which is something you shouldn't do, but we did it like twice. Three times, probably. I'm pretty sure we did that for bouquet. Especially ‘cause at that point it didn't matter. We were just a local band. I think we did it for Speak Less, too. Anyway, to go back to the original point. [Laughs]

We were in a different headspace. We were already writing Speak Less, so by the time Speak It Into Existence came out, people were like, “Oh, y'all wanted to do this sound. It's like Swancore,” and I already started to move away from wanting to do that, by like 2018, 2019. But I'm not gonna get rid of songs, we still like those songs. I’m still happy with it. I don’t know, it's interesting. [Laughs]

SWIM: I think some people might be under the impression that when bands write albums it’s like, ‘Okay, we’re going to sit in a room, we’re going to bang out these eight to twelve songs, and it’s all written at the same time,’ and I think especially in DIY spaces and music creation in general, you guys are pulling from different places, seeing what works. So, you’re very different people for different songs, rather than like an entire album.

MATT: Yeah. I mean a band with a label and a budget, it's like, ‘Okay, we're gonna take two months and go write and record this record.’ We can't do that. We get together once a week and write songs. Luckily for future things, it's been going very fast recently, which has been really cool. But yeah, Speak It Into Existence and Speak Less took such a long time ‘cause we were just chipping away at it. Then recording takes even longer, ‘cause you can't just take two weeks or a month and sit in the studio.

CALEB: Even as an example: today, we were tracking a song for bass, and it's like, “Oh, we got X amount of songs we want to do,” and then this one song took like three or four hours to track. It's like, “Well, that's it for the day, we'll figure out another day we can get together next where people can take time off.” You're gonna spend eight hours a day, like a normal job, in the studio each day. It'll be like, “We'll come back to this tomorrow!” And it's like, “No, I'll see you in a week and a half. Maybe.” This is the first time we've seen David in like two months, ‘cause you know, life happens.

SWIM: You gotta prioritize music over those fires, David. Priorities.

[All laugh]

MATT: No, but it's been cool now. I think we're in a groove right now, which is nice. It takes a long time and a lot of work to make an album, and I think you’re bound to be – by the time it's coming out – a little bit over it. Especially in a DIY band, because it takes so long.

CALEB: But then also when it comes out, and then people actually respond to it well, then it gets re-contextualized. It’s a weird thing. I saw this very recently again, where somebody was mad at a band for being like, “I don't like this anymore!” You can still like it, but they're a person too, even if they created it!

I know going into the release, I was like, “I like this, but I'm changing as a person. This represents who I was a year ago, and I feel disconnected from it.” But then, when it came out, people started liking it, we started playing the songs live, and I was like, ‘Okay, now I have re-contextualized it all. I love this.’ Especially particular songs. I will always love playing “Louisiana Purchase.” I'll always love playing “Exist Warp Brakes.” So, all that hurt I had prior is gone now for that aspect of things.

SWIM: That makes a lot of sense. Any lasting thoughts on the album turning five? Anything you want to throw out there?

CALEB: I'm glad that we still exist five years later, you know? That's always something to be grateful for. Speak It Into Existence was named after that, in a way. We said we were gonna do a second record, so we're gonna hold ourselves to it and we're gonna make it happen.

It Wasn't Supposed To Be Like This is also, in a way, a statement of, “We're still existing, we're still creating music, and we're grateful to do that.” You can take the title in a positive or a negative way. We weren't supposed to start this band in 2015 and still be going 10 years later off of nothing, really. I'm grateful to still be at it and still be feeling even more inspired than ever before.

MATT: You got any plugs, Kevin? You're usually the plug man.

KEVIN: I don't really have a whole lot of plugs. In terms of Speak It Into Existence, it's still out on vinyl, still got CDs. I want to do another tape run, but money, you know. So, outside of that, we're working on new music. We're working on old new music and then we're working on new new music. So old, new music should come out sometime this year. New, new music should come out next year, most likely.

CALEB: And then new versions of old music, in a live way, will come even sooner–

KEVIN: In the form of a live album that we did celebrating 10 years of a band with friends and shit. In the form of possibly a DVD, if I can figure that out.

MATT: Oh, I didn't even know you were gonna do that!

KEVIN: So, there's your scoop. [Laughs]

SWIM: Nice! Well, I got the exclusive one, thank you!

KEVIN: Always. Every interview has to have an exclusive drop.

That's about it. Got a couple of shows. They're fests, they're far apart.

MATT: We're spending all this time on new music. So, festivals, that’s what we got.

SWIM: Well, as a fan and someone who found you guys through Speak It Into Existence, thank you for that album. Love that you guys are still here and doing it. I appreciate y’all coming on for this first interview!

KEVIN: Absolutely, thanks for having us.

CALEB: It's fun to talk shit over a mic.

[All laugh]

SWIM: Love you guys, thank you!

March 25, 2025

Don't Really Mind These Miles: An Interview with Marble Teeth

March 25, 2025/ Josh Ejnes

For most of my life, I’ve been chasing the high of listening to The Replacements for the first time. It happened back in seventh grade. I was a performative hater of anything modern, and I had a problem: I couldn’t deny that I was starting to enjoy Green Day. Fearing that I might be on the verge of betraying my “born in the wrong generation” aesthetic, I Googled “Old bands that sound like Green Day,” hoping to find a group from before I existed that could scratch the same itch. Through this search, I found “Bastards of Young,” which led me to Tim, which led me to Let it Be, which led me to everything else, and before I knew it, I had developed a burning love for the band that outlived (and helped guide me out of) the pretentious phase which had led me to them in the first place. It totally changed the way I consumed and thought about music. I just had never been into a band like that. I didn’t know there could be a band like that.

Though I’ve never had that exact feeling again (and likely never will), there are a few bands that have gotten me pretty close. Cloud Nothings come to mind as one example, a band that grabbed me at first listen and totally changed my understanding of the ways melody and fuzz can coexist. Prefab Sprout, who pushed pop songwriting in directions I had never considered, is another. Most recently, I’ve become obsessed with Marble Teeth, the solo project of Decatur, Illinois-based singer-songwriter Caleb Jefson.

I came across Marble Teeth last August when they opened for Retirement Party at Beat Kitchen. Prior to the show I’d never heard of them, but they very quickly had me hooked. Most of what they played that night came from their most recent release, top 10 times i’ve cried, a record that at different points finds itself living in the worlds of alt-country, indie folk, and straight-up Americana. It wasn’t necessarily a sound that I expected to hear at an emo show, but I couldn’t deny that it worked.

Beyond the music, I was fascinated by Caleb as an artist. His merch spread was like nothing I’d ever seen; sitting next to a table with CDs and zines was a portable clothing rack with about 20 Marble Teeth shirts, no two of which were exactly alike. Each one that I flipped through had a new design or was pressed into a different brand/color of shirt, meaning that they had each been individually crafted rather than ordered in bulk from a distributor, truly DIY.

When I got home and looked more into Marble Teeth, I discovered that this is just how Caleb does things. He handles everything on his records: the playing, the recording, the mixing, the album covers. Beyond the unique shirts, he seems to be constantly learning new crafts and applying these skills to his merch; at different times over the past few months, he’s offered both custom embroidered hats and Marble Teeth branded gloves, all homemade. When he worked with Klepto Phase to put out a vinyl pressing of top 10 times i’ve cried last fall, each record was accompanied by an exquisitely designed lyric zine. He’s an artist in the truest sense of the word.

As I dug into Marble Teeth’s back catalog, two records I found myself coming back to a lot were Cars and Park, released in 2018 and 2020, respectively. Where top 10 times is clearly influenced by older folk and country music, Cars and Park take their approach more from contemporary bedroom pop/singer-songwriter-tinged emo artists like Slaughter Beach, Dog and Trace Mountains. They’re raw and emotional records with a sound that’s incredibly in my wheelhouse. It was the most I’d been obsessed with an artist since finding Tim; there were whole weeks where those two records were all that I listened to.

A few months after first hearing Marble Teeth at Beat Kitchen, I was lucky enough to meet Caleb at a house show in Chicago where he mentioned that a vinyl pressing of Cars and Park was in the works: one record that would have Cars on one side and Park on the other. This was right around when I was playing both non-stop, so I was ecstatic. That vinyl is now pressed, ready to ship, and up for sale directly through Marble Teeth’s own website. I sat down with Caleb to discuss his creative process, finally getting these records out on vinyl, and how he feels about them five to seven years after their release. Here is that conversation.

This interview has been edited for length and clarity.

SWIM: To get started, I was curious how you guys came to this decision to put Cars and Park out on vinyl at this point, with their release having been quite a few years in the past.

CALEB: I got the opportunity through a program at the local college here where they were doing a small pressing of something, like only a hundred of them. Honestly, these have been a long time in the making. So, top 10 times i’ve cried was being recorded but not even planned to be put out yet. Neither of those albums [Cars or Park] really had much of a physical release. I did some tapes that were split albums where I had Cars on one side and Park on the other, but it’s been a couple of years. I just thought, given only a hundred, those are old enough that I'm not gonna be pushing them so hard. The people who want them will definitely want them because Cars and Park have their fan base. And then the new stuff has picked up people, but yeah, the day-one fans love those, I think, I hope.

SWIM: So I know you just said you put out some tapes of those two, but in general, with your stuff for physical releases, are you doing just like CDs when you go on a run? Is that more your normal thing?

CALEB: I've done that in the past where, yeah, I'll just hand-burn CDs. Physical copies are definitely something I've not put a ton of money into. When it comes to band operations and stuff, it really is just me. I have a live band that I play with, but I play all the instruments on the records and do all the recording and writing. So when it comes to financial backing for things, it's literally just me paying for it out of pocket. In the past, I've done the cheapest way possible, generally homemade stuff. I splurged for a couple of runs of tapes before a big tour or something just to have something else that looks nice.

SWIM: Nice. When it comes to vinyl, are you personally a collector or fan?

CALEB: Yeah, yeah, I like vinyl.

SWIM: Do you have any particular records in your collection that are your favorites or mean something to you?

CALEB: My buddy Jacob gave me a copy of Nashville Skyline by Bob Dylan a couple of years ago, and that kind of started it. He was like, ‘This is for your Bob Dylan collection,’ and I only had two of his before that. Honestly, I was a big fan, but I only had a couple that I had found, and then I was like, huh, I didn't even realize I had a collection. After that, I kind of started buying a ton. So that one's special because it kind of sparked that, “All right, I'm just going to buy all these up,” I guess. I'm a huge Dylan head, and he just has so many albums. It's fun to try out the ones I've never listened to before. Just put it on the record rather than trying to get through it on streaming. Sometimes it's way easier to skip around and stuff.

SWIM: Right, yeah. I know I saw you posted your Bob Dylan spread. It was the size of a quilt.

CALEB: Yeah, I was inspired by some other dude who had me beat by a couple, I think, but just like had them all laid out on the floor of the rug.

SWIM: That's sick. So, back to Cars and Park and putting them out again in your live show. Do you still play many of the songs from these records? Or do you mostly play stuff from top 10?

CALEB: Up until very recently, there were still Cars and Park on the set list. Probably “Funk Track” off Cars was really the only one getting played, and then some Park songs, like “The Park” and “The Neighbor.” Actually, “Quick Stop” off Park, we still do play. If I'm playing a solo set, I have a lot more (from them) I can pull from than the band. With the band, it's kind of just the couple that we've practiced because I record all the parts, and then I’m teaching them to other people and letting them kind of put their flair on it. I've had a couple different lineups of the band. The second to most recent lineup we've had was still playing Cars and Park stuff, but now I think we're just doing “Quick Stop.”

SWIM: As part of this process, when you had to listen back to Cars and Park, was there anything that surprised you about either release? I don't know how often you were thinking about them beyond playing the songs before this, but going back and listening to the recording, is there anything that stood out to you where you were like, ‘I didn't think much of this at the time, but this is something?’

CALEB: Before getting them back, actually, not really, because I just kind of sent all the stuff off. But once I got the test pressings and listened to those, it made the mix really pop. It definitely sounds way better than just listening on a streamer because it was mastered by somebody as well. I didn't originally—Cars was mastered, but Park was exported straight from GarageBand onto the internet, essentially…it's quieter than most stuff on Spotify, so hearing it on the record just makes it sound nice and big. I still have a soft spot for those songs, for sure. It just maybe took me back in time a little bit.

SWIM: I know both records have very similar cover aesthetics, and you said in the past you put them out with the tape, like one on one side, one on the other. When you made Cars, did you have the idea, like, ‘I'm going to make Park, and it's going to be kind of a sister record?’ Or were these songs you had left over, or did it come together over time as being a shared existence?

CALEB: I definitely had the album cover for Cars even before there was much of an album written. There was just this sign by my house that I drove by every day, and I was like, ‘I want to make that an album cover.’ And then the Park sign is just right down the street, and I had already put out Cars before I noticed how good the other one was. I was like, oh my gosh, perfect follow-up–four letters on literally the same road in my town. Sadly, the Cars sign has since been torn down. But the Park one is still standing. I definitely didn't plan to make a follow-up, but thematically, I think it kind of is a follow-up or almost a part two. A before and after.

SWIM: Yeah, because even across the two, I know you have “Runners World” (on Cars) and then “Runners World 2” (on Park), which is a different take on a similar riff. Did you write two versions of that song, or did you get to one later?

CALEB: The original “Runners World” on Cars was just the song, that was the only song I had. Then one time, I was practicing up a live band when I really only had Cars and a couple of Park songs written. We were just trying to figure out what we could do because I had 13 songs back then, essentially. So (we were) figuring out which ones we could do, and I was playing the “Runners World” riff, and Paul, the drummer, started drumming. I had this poem that I had just written up, and I was like, whoa, this kind of sets over it. So that just kind of turned into the sequel. Definitely wasn't planned originally to do that, but that might have been the first example of it… But, well, even on some original Bandcamp stuff—I have two different versions of a song called “High School Football Championship,” that's also on Cars. But that's something I really like in other artists that I enjoy: finding a song that they've done different versions of or different live takes of it.

SWIM: Because I think I saw on one of the Extra Volumes (on Bandcamp), you have one of the songs that ended up making it on top 10 as well. I'm forgetting which one it is now.

CALEB: Oh, yeah, yeah, “the gun.”

SWIM: Yeah yeah yeah.

CALEB: It's an extended version of an Extras song. It's just verse one on Extras, and I think I honestly had had a few verses, it just wasn't— I probably had tweaked the lyrics since then and didn't have the full band vision of it in my head, so I didn't want to milk it. With the Extras I was trying to do short stuff, and it was just recording in a couple of days’ time.

SWIM: Do you try to do much interpolation of other people's stuff? I was listening to Marble Teeth, the self-titled one, and you have that song, “John Jackson.” Is that like a Jack Johnson riff, kind of off “Banana Pancakes?”

CALEB: Yeah, yeah, just playing those chords, they remind me of “Banana Pancakes” and “Upside Down,” but there's definitely the major seven or whatever chord that is…the way the chord sounded made me think about Jack Johnson, for sure. So then, yeah, I just switched it around.

SWIM: Sick. And then there’s one thing I've been thinking about, too, because I listened to Cars and Park a lot before this, and before that, I'd been listening to a lot of top 10 times, and it's very different. The approach on top 10 times feels a lot more rootsy, and I know there are many years in between the records, but I was curious about the change in sound between Cars and Park to top 10 times. Is it that you always wanted to make something that sounds like top 10 times, but you didn't have the equipment, or you were getting around to that songwriting? Is it just your taste has changed over time and this is reflective of what you're listening to now?

CALEB: Yeah, probably a little bit of all of those. I had been in pop-punk-type bands before, so I made louder rock songs. Definitely with Cars or Self-titled at least, because those were the first things I recorded at home. I was definitely going for more of a bedroom pop, softer sound, and since then, I've gotten way more into country and roots and folk. Maybe not folk, but country was something I would actively say that I disliked in high school and younger, but I've definitely come around on it in my 20s just listening to Dylan and Neil Young. Honestly, the American Anthology of Folk Music, this compilation by this dude, Harry Smith, that the Smithsonian put out, just lots of good old-timey tunes on there. That's what I was, post-COVID, listening to a lot more, stuff like that, so I don't know if I would have tried to make something that sounded like that back then, but I definitely was going for quieter at the beginning.

SWIM: For sure, it reminds me a little, the Cars and Parks stuff, of Slaughter Beach Dog.

CALEB: That's definitely 100% what I was listening to. I mean, Motorcycle.jpg and Birdie coming out pretty quickly, one after another, changed my music taste completely. I speak for a lot of people in the scene, probably when I say that, but I think those were a shift for people my age getting into a lot more Americana-type sounds and slide guitar.

SWIM: I was always curious about it because I found out about you over the last year. I first saw you when you opened for Retirement Party with OK Cool, and it seems like whenever I'm on Instagram and I click on an emo or pop-punky band, I see that you often follow them, but then when I see you post music you're listening to, I feel like it's more recently folk stuff or like, Poco-style rock.

CALEB: Yeah, I'm definitely not listening to much emo these days, to be honest. I mean, there's definitely stuff from my youth that has a nostalgia factor, but I'm not, like, seeking out new stuff in that vein—although the new Hotline TNT album kind of threw me back into the rock and roll world a bit. Yeah, like I was saying, I've been going back in time, just further back, trying to… just the story songs and the banjo and mandolin, those instruments have been really fascinating to me recently. They just sound good. Less abrasive to my ears, too, honestly. I was just getting headaches from listening to a lot of music in the car all the time.

SWIM: So, did you record Cars, Park, and top 10 all at home kind of on the same type of setup, or did you also have an equipment change or upgrade to a different system?

CALEB: Probably the closest (in recording method) would have been Park and top 10. Cars I actually recorded on an iPad on GarageBand.

SWIM: That's wild.

CALEB: Yeah, oh man. Yeah. I'm just thinking back on it as a mess of cables and converters and stuff. I have recorded a couple of projects that way through the iPad, Self-titled, and then some other projects for other friends. I felt like I was kind of getting good at that, and I liked GarageBand a lot, so then I bought a Macbook, and Park was the first thing I recorded on it, so I was figuring things out. That's why I feel like those two sound kind of different, the vocal and the guitar sounds, at least, just because I was plugging directly in through an interface instead of through an iPad.

SWIM: I know Cars has way more keys and synth than Park, definitely (more) than top 10. Is that just because when you're recording into an iPad directly using some of those direct MIDI software instruments?

CALEB: Honestly, all of those are a... I don't think I have any... there's a drum and a...sorry, I'm so spacey. No, all of those are real keyboards, a little Casio I've got. I've only used a GarageBand drum machine one time on “Lonerisnt” the single. But it was also the last thing I... that was truly the last thing I recorded on the iPad right after Cars. I recorded a single, got the MacBook, and started doing stuff on there. So there's Park, and then Extra was kind of a little more experimenting with the laptop. 8 More was, like, I'm kind of locking it, have to make it sound a little more hi-fi on the laptop, and then top 10 was like, alright, let's EQ this shit.

SWIM: Yeah, because on top 10 you have way more filtering and stuff on the vocals, and it feels like more an artistic choice in the mix than just making it legible.

CALEB: I definitely just spent a lot more time on this one, that's for sure. I mean, when you're doing it yourself especially, it's like every project you do is pretty much a huge learning experience. It's like you work on it, and then you put it out, and then you listen to it, and you're like, ‘I like this, I don't like this, let's try again, use all these new tricks that I just figured out.’ Every song you finish, you're like, wow, I wish I could have done that thing I figured out on every other song I've ever made, but let's keep it going.

SWIM: For sure. So you put out the vinyl of top 10, and now you’ve got the Cars and Park one, does it make you think your next album, you might want to do vinyl at release? Or is it the sort of thing where if the opportunity comes again like this, you would, but otherwise it's not really top of mind?

CALEB: Yeah, I'm so bad at planning ahead.

SWIM: Sure.

CALEB: If I could find somewhere that was really interested in doing that…because I haven't even really started on anything post-top 10. I have songs, but recording-wise, there’s nothing finished. So maybe I should start planning ahead and getting everything together. My problem is once it's done, I'm not waiting on anybody to mix it or anything, so I'm just ‘I want to get this out ASAP,’ and I'd rather promote something that's already out than try and sell people a record (that will) come out in three months.

SWIM: Definitely. On the top 10 release, you did those drawings for the tracklist on the back. Do you like that part of this kind of (physical) production where you get new places where you can do some sort of artistic output related to the old project?

CALEB: Oh, yeah, I mean, it being kind of a one-man operation in that way, I really just get to throw every hobby and craft I encounter at this and try and incorporate it in some way. There's been a couple of pieces I've commissioned out, but pretty much from the beginning, everything I've put out I've made to some extent, and I really like figuring stuff out and getting my own style. It's pretty amateurish, you could say, from recording to drawing or the production side of things, but I think there's a charm that's kind of realistic when you're not trying to curate something to the point where you’re getting the best of the best. This is just my life's work, essentially. I don't have it packaged up underneath.

SWIM: Yeah, no, I get that. So that was the main stuff I had to ask you. I have two really specific questions about lyrics from Park that I've just been curious about, if that's cool.

CALEB: Sure.

SWIM: So I always thought about this line on “The Monkeys” where you say, “We're dancing in the dark, just like that singer you like,” which I think is a sick line. I was always curious if there was someone in your life who liked Bruce Springsteen and you didn't. I mean, it's just a cool way to say that because I feel like a lot of people have dropped Springsteen's name in a song on purpose, and you kind of, whether intentionally or not, avoided it in that way. I always thought it was kind of sick.

CALEB: That's funny. I've gotten that a couple of times, but it is not about Bruce Springsteen.

SWIM: Oh, really?

CALEB: It's about dancing in the literal darkness, like a different singer. I'll just keep it unnamed, but I do like that. I know that's just one of those things about writing lyrics where they totally take on a life of their own, and also, maybe I'm just dumb for not realizing that that's exactly like Bruce Springsteen. So many things where it's like, yeah, I almost don't want to say it because I don't want to change everyone's perception of it. It's whoever you think it is, but it's cool because, yeah, you are not the first person to say that.

SWIM: That's fascinating. And then the other one I was always curious about was in part of the song “The Park,” you talk about not being “allowed to watch this program as a kid” and not getting someone's references. I was curious if there's any specific instance behind that or if it's just something you've run up against when it comes to media.

CALEB: That one I can specify. It was definitely Spongebob. That was my inspiration behind that one. Spongebob or Friends, maybe those are the two that I really imagine in my head when I'm thinking of that. But that one I definitely leave up to interpretation as well. I'd be interested to hear what shows other people were not allowed to watch.

SWIM: Sure. It reminds me of when I was in kindergarten. For some reason, some kids in my kindergarten class were allowed to watch Boy Meets World, but I wasn't. And they would have long debates about Boy Meets World stuff, and I just had to sit there.

CALEB: Yeah, everyone's talking about it, and you're like, hmm. Or just…you're telling them a story, and they're like, oh, that’s like the episode of this thing, and you're like, yeah, I understand. Can I finish my story, please?

SWIM: Yeah, for sure. Sick, that was all I had to ask. Is there anything you would want to add about the vinyl release or the process around it?

CALEB: I don't know. I'm excited to do it. This was supposed to be the first vinyl that I got, but it's kind of just been a long process for various reasons. I'm bad at sending emails and stuff. And I got lucky with Klepto Phase reaching out about top 10. Like I said, these were slated to get produced when top 10 wasn't really finalized or anything yet. I had most of those songs written and somewhat recorded. I'm just excited to get them. It's sweet that people—I mean, it's sweet that you listened to them a ton and were thinking about this, and you were interested enough to want to write about it. Because they definitely sound—I mean, listening back to them, they sound young, but that's just because it's me. It's, like, I love that guy, but he's also me four years ago. So I kind of hate him a little bit, but...

Yeah, it's sweet that people like those albums, and (those were) the basis of this project. It’s what I was touring on for the majority of when I was getting out there. So it's kind of cool that people still like them, and I appreciate them sticking with me on the new stuff. I mean, I look at the streams, and every album kind of has more than the last, so it feels good as an artist to feel like you're picking up steam and not like, “Oh, you guys only like this old one, now I have to try and recreate that magic or just, like, move on and lose you all.”

The combined vinyl pressing of Cars and Park is available now directly through Marble Teeth’s website.

Josh Ejnes is a writer and musician living in Chicago. You can keep up with his writing on music and sports on Twitter and listen to his band Cutaway Car here.

February 19, 2025

Big Girl Are Ready to Be Your DIY God

February 19, 2025/ Katie Hayes

Big Girl’s performance was the crux of a protest show held during last year’s South By Southwest, where a slew of punk-adjacent acts gathered to play a thrashing, beer-soaked free set under a highway. On stage, frontperson Kaitlin Pelkey is flanked by two backup singers, Christina Schwedler and Melody Stolpp, whose sharply coordinated moves set a ferociously campy scene. Their show is quite the production, with multiple guitars, choreography, and Pelkey’s powerhouse vocals wrangling the chaos. The singers’ frenzied dance lights up the band’s layered rock sound, miraculously weaving a biting punk aesthetic out of melody and perfectly timed movements. How the hell did Big Girl come up with this strange concoction of a live show? “Be truthful and be stupid,” frontperson Kaitlin Pelkey says.

At the dyed-red heart of Big Girl’s songs, Pelkey’s voice contorts and swirls, never missing a note, yet not quite content to settle on one for too long either. The band’s new single, “DIY GOD,” finds expressive electric guitars chugging, sparkling, and wailing in Pelkey’s wake, trailing her like the briefcase chained to her wrist in the music video. There’s something a little unsettling about the tone of her voice: although pretty, her melodies are a little loopy, a little queasy, channeling ghosts of glam rock past in a way that counterbalances the songs’ scuzzy instruments. Turns out, a touch of theatrics is the perfect canvas for the NYC band’s very real experiences and emotions.

"DIY GOD" is just the first taste of a forthcoming EP called DYE which is coming later this year. Pelkey wrote most of these songs in 2020 in the midst of her mother’s dire health crisis, which she eventually succumbed to, passing away in 2021. “A lot of the stuff I write about is pretty heavy, pretty dark,” admits Pelkey. Paradoxically, the depth of her painful moments fuels the panache that sets Big Girl apart. “Just remembering that you have to keep the joy in your story - it actually elevates it,” she says about the maximalist aesthetic of their live performances and forthcoming EP. Pelkey’s songs strike a remarkable balance between maudlin and cathartic, both extremes fueled by the same deep well of emotion.

Red keeps showing up in Big Girl’s new era, whether seeping out of Pelkey’s freshly colored hair in a sink or lighting up her energy in an angry swath. “It’s bloody,” she says about the motif. Dyed-red hair isn’t just a stylistic choice, she elaborates: it’s “transformation on your own terms…bringing color to a place that once had none.”

Big Girl’s guitarist Crispin Swank produced DYE with help from Justin Pizzoferrato (Speedy Ortiz, Dinosaur Jr., Pixies), who had also helped them bring their debut album, Big Girl vs. God, to life. They knocked the EP’s five songs out in just three studio days, tightening up their sound from the manic sprawl of older songs like “Big Car Full of Mistakes.” In contrast, “DIY GOD” sticks with just one time signature throughout—although don’t expect a clean-cut indie rock track, with Pelkey’s voice maintaining a dash of drama a la Puberty 2-era Mitski. The single is a lurching, groovy confessional, culminating in Swank’s guitar shredding Weezer-style behind exasperated choruses. “No one can fuck it up like I do,” Pelkey sneers, summing up the EP’s flamboyant existential crisis in a single line.

Disassembling—hitting a wall and starting over—succumbing to weirdness and chaos. It’s all a part of Big Girl’s journey through DYE. Quitting a job on a sunny day, dyeing one’s hair just to feel something. Despite the band’s larger-than-life sound, their struggles are the same as everybody else trying to find meaning in an uncertain era. Big Girl’s snark is just one stripe in a swirl of deep experience: grief, joy, and rage at the horrors of our modern world. But what better vessel for angst than sharp, relentless rock songs?

“So watch me burn it all ‘cause I’m so bored that I told you the truth,” Pelkey howls on “DIY GOD,” wrestling with the apparent futility of… well, everything. The final scene of the music video shows Pelkey thrashing in the waves on the Miami shore, melodramatically raging against the impossibility of art, of joy, of any hope at all. The song answers its own question in a flash of graffiti in the middle of the music video: “Red Hot Salvation.” With their newest songs, Big Girl’s underlying belief shines through that creating DIY art is, in and of itself, the salvation that they seek.

Katie Hayes is a music writer and karaoke superstar in Austin, Texas. She is from there, but between 2010 and now, also lived in Lubbock, TX, Portland, OR, and a camper. Her life is a movie in which her bearded dragon Pancake is the star. You can check out her Substack here and some of her other writing here. She’s writing a book about growing up alongside her favorite band, Paramore.

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Big Girl Are Ready to Be Your DIY God

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